Would you pay over $1,000 for Metadata.guru when you could get MetadataGuru.com for just $10?
This morning I posted about GoDaddy’s auction results for new top level domain names thus far. The post included nine domain names that sold for over $1,000 at auction.
I totally missed something very, very interesting about some of these domain purchases.
As Joseph Peterson pointed out in a comment, two of these domains had matching .com domains that were freely available to register at the time these people paid over a grand for the new domains.
Queens.guru sold for $1,025 when you could have picked up QueensGuru.com for $10. Metadata.guru sold for $1,035 when Metadataguru.com was available for just $10. (Both domains have since been registered.)
So at least four people walked right past unregistered .com domains to bid $1,000 on the new TLD versions of these domains.
These people either viewed the new domains as better than .com or they got swept up in the excitement and weren’t paying attention.
Are they better than the .com’s? I’d argue not in 2014. Not when you don’t also own the matching .com.
If nothing else, if you’re going to buy these domains you’d invest another $10 to protect yourself, wouldn’t you? In fact, some of the people who paid over $1,000 for domains already own the matching .com’s, which is probably why they went after the new TLDs.
Domainer Extraordinaire says
Auction fever/stupidity.
Acro says
Need lots of data to confirm a trend. Personally, I registered *.guru AND the matching keywordguru in .com on one occasion.
Konstantinos Zournas says
All the available matching .com domains I have posted on my blog, as free, have been grabbed within minutes from domainers.
Andrew Allemann says
Will you post a link to one do the posts?
Konstantinos Zournas says
http://onlinedomain.com/2014/02/06/news/7-new-gtld-domains-sold-for-12540-a-piece-at-godaddy-nature-photography-color-photography/
and
http://onlinedomain.com/2014/02/10/news/company-that-spent-25080-for-2-equipment-domain-names-buys-7-more-cheaper-this-time/
Frank Schilling says
So it begins. I predict this so called “stupidity” will become more frequent. And then one day it won’t look so stupid, the corresponding com will drop and nobody will be there to pick it up.
iTommy says
ok, drop all your coms then..
Konstantinos Zournas says
This is stupid at this time.
“One day” it might not be stupid but we live now.
This “one day” statements are as vague as it gets.
I know today .com has value now.
Maybe in 100 years we use our minds to navigate between world data but until that change has actually arrived I will use my hands.
Mr.T says
Wait for the big companies to start marketing their new gTLD domains. That “one day” timeframe may come sooner than you think.
In most countries across Europe .com has always been less popular than ccTLD’s/gTLD’s. As soon as the average joe gets a hang of the new tld’s, you’ll see that .com’s are going downhill.
A good example: Why would anyone want to type/say/brand DomainHoldings.com when they can type/say/brand Domain.holdings? It’s shorter, looks better and it’s far more brandable. It’s mostly people that are heavily invested in .com that don’t want to see these big changes take place. We all know why.
Joseph Peterson says
Why, Frank?
I’m perfectly prepared to see great brands build on a new extension and display it in their advertising. But, as you’ve frequently said yourself, .COM isn’t going away. So a business would be taking a huge risk in allowing a matching brand name in .COM to exist outside its control. Why would they do so?
Would you like to put a little money on this prediction? I’ll bet you $1,000 that DomainHoldings.com maintains its .COM address as long as it’s in business under the brand name. Even if they register Domain.Holdings … and even if they choose to display Domain.Holdings prominently in lieu of their .COM, your specific prediction will not come true. “[T]he corresponding com will [in my opinion never] drop.” And if it did, somebody most definitely “will be there to pick it up”.
I can never win this bet. As long as DomainHoldings maintains its .COM, you can still say they’ll eventually drop it. So I’ll never collect $1k. It’s impossible. But I’m confident enough that I’m right on this question that I’ll risk $1k with no possible win.
Joseph Peterson says
… Better yet, please pick a date on which you’ll drop all .COMs in your portfolio whose final word corresponds to an nTLD. On that date, if “nobody [is] there to pick [them] up”, then you win.
ChuckWagen says
You mixed up your metadataguru.com example just a bit.
Andrew Allemann says
Thanks. Freudian slip I suppose. Fixed.
jZ says
people have been sold the ‘all .com’s are registered’ propaganda tag and believe it, so they don’t even check.
Ryan says
Let’s face it there are dumb people out there, that only have one vision, they think they are going back int time to 1995 again.
You know when you have that feeling that something is a sucker’s bet, well this could be one of them.
If you are able to register a Keyword.Guru, and that KeywordGuru.com is available in .com, chances are you did not get a real good .guru to begin with.
Half of these guys will lose interest, when it comes time for renewals, it seems like many speculators like .mobi, guys were fighting, and crying over it when the sedo auction went bust. It was good times. The numbers these registries are reporting for the most part 12 of the 14 are sub 10K in regs.
Aaron Strong says
My “new G’s” look so cool without the .com, .net, .org attached. Some of you folks really need to open up to the unique opportunity we are presented with……I already know of a major clothing company already working on a high budget marketing campaign with the new domain. Their old domain was “WhateverClothing.com” and now they are going to use “Whatever.Clothing”…..
Ryan says
No, he invested $3K into x.technology and now he has a vested interest, and feels the need to advertise his interest, this is what money does.
Aaron Strong says
Ryan,
I am not advertising. I have been open and honest with my position change. I have put my money where my mouth is. That is more than I can say for the many New G bashers who are secretly buying the New G’s. You will see the switch at some point and when you do see it, it may be too late.
Adam says
Haven’t bashed and not buying atm.
Strong v Strong. Good luck
Aaron Strong says
Cheers…Strong Vs. Strong…..I can’t wait until the .Strong extension……I guess you won’t be registering?…lol…
JZ says
heh, you make a $1k sale and now they’re super fabulous.
JZ says
the great thing about .com,net,org is that they aren’t language restricted. if the “new g’s” are the future then i guess every single language on the planet is going to need their own set of them. this combined with the restrictive nature of the decriptive gtld (ie only someone in the clothing market will use .clothing, etc) really limits who you will be able to sell to and who will be able to use them. don’t lose yourself in the hype.
[email protected] says
“don’t lose yourself in the hype.”…………I feel the “hype” has been defending the .com. while beating up the “new G’s”. I was involved in that hype not long ago. I have chosen to blaze my own trail as most “experts” in the domaining community are not embracing the New G’s…….In fact I have heard several of these “experts” formerly known as “professional”, resort to personal attacks while trying to defend their position…..I am a cowboy and I am not going to be “herded” up in the corner as they secretly continue to register the New G’s in private.. .. JZ, Don’t lose yourself in the hype!…
Joseph Peterson says
@Aaron,
You’re right. There’s room for a lot of very different strategies to coexist. They’re not incompatible. Success depends mostly on execution — whether it’s buying .ventures or buying .com. As long as everybody thinks things through on their own without being swayed too much by hype, I figure there’s a chance they’ll come out ahead.
Most of us are pursuing some kind of mixed strategy. That mixture varies from person to person. People will fail and succeed with .COM, and people will fail and succeed with new extensions. There’s no magic formula for everybody.
At the moment, however, I see a lot of domainers who aren’t thinking for themselves. They see the bandwagon rolling by with cheering passengers and wonder if those guys know more than they do. So without sitting down to tabulate the pros and cons, a lot of domainers just rush to climb aboard in case they’re left out. But why assume that other domainers who’ve jumped aboard know more than you do? They’re probably on the bandwagon for the same reason — because they’re afraid that if they stop to evaluate anything, they’ll miss their “chance”.
This sort of panic from domainers and established businesses is great for generating revenue for registries and registrars … and blogger affiliates.
Mark says
Aaron, who exactly is secretly registering new G’s? Spill it, don’t be shy.
Joseph Peterson says
@JZ,
You’re right on this, but it won’t apply 100% of the time.
Language-defined extensions will prove limiting for brands that aim for global reach. Yet not all domains need to be used internationally. We’ll see some vanity extensions being used within campaigns for brands rather than as brand names themselves. Marketing campaigns are often segmented by language and/or nation. And it’s also true that many businesses seek only a local clientele. For example, I doubt any end user for .PLUMBING need worry about being confined to English.
Startups need to think (and mostly do think) about the possibility of “pivoting” down the road. If their service offering or clientele changes, they’ll be much less restricted by extensions such as .COM, .CO, .NET, .ORG — or, for that matter, by .INC or .WEB — than by something like .CLOTHING or .LOAN. Many clothing companies hope to present an image rather than just threads. And financial companies invariably expand beyond just loan offerings.
Specificity isn’t always an advantage. For branding purposes, it can be a straitjacket.
Emphasis on the “can be”. For many, specificity is exactly what they need. And they can get that with nTLDs or with established extensions like .COM.
Johnnie says
It just proves that people are stupid, nothing else. The registries and registrars are well aware of this. Mining stupidity has worked since the dawn of man. I don’t see any cowboy in this either, more like a Kool Aid drinker going to hang out in the forest.
Jim Holleran says
This Gtld talk is getting so old. Let’s all stop talking about it for 1 year and see if it’s successful or not. Let the numbers speak for themselves in 1 year. Good luck to those who invest, I am not, been there done that, going to spend my money on a Valentine’s gift for my wife instead, better ROI in the bedroom for that(lol)
Henry says
I hear you, and Amen to that!
John says
Wouldn’t pay $.01 for either .guru’s mentioned in the article. Only a tiny number of .guru’s would even interest me at all.
DrDomainer says
The matching .com is not available!
You can’t compare domains this way
Metadataguru.com
Metadata.guru
This would be a better way to compare it.
Metadata.com
Metadata.guru
@ Frank
I do believe you can make money with gTLDs but they are NEVER going to be
the QUEEN BEE .com
I have bought a couple of .guru
but I know deep down they will NEVER
be a true GURU like .com
jZ says
that doesn’t make sense. since .guru is a descriptive tld its part of the name. not just an extension. so metadata may offer services but not be a ‘guru’ on metadata while metadata.guru is ‘supposed’ to be a metadata expert(guru). if people treat these descriptive gtlds like .com, that’s a fail right there.
John says
P.S. And I’m originally from New York as well, including NYC. “Queens guru” – yeah right. No thanks. Find another great “queens or queen’s” attempt.
Adam says
Lol. Writer mistake or Wp auto correct
MetadataGuru.com sold for $1,035 when Metadataguru.com was available for just $10. (Both domains have since been registered
Joseph Peterson says
@ DrDomainer,
If I say “Amazon” or “Ebay” or “Google”, do you know what website I’m referring to? Yes, the .com.
If I say “Metadata”, do you assume Metadata.guru? No, of course you don’t. The name of such a website would not be “Metadat”. It would necessarily be “Metadata Guru” or else “Metadata dot Guru”, depending on whether they must differentiate themselves from another domain of the same name that they don’t own.
So in this respect the comparison between Metadata.guru and MetadataGuru.com is not only valid but crucial.
Ask Join.me if JoinMe.com is an equivalent representation of their brand name or not. They made a hefty purchase expressing the affirmative, and they’re hardly alone in seeing the correspondence.
Ryan says
Domainers have been taken out of the game with the new gtld’s, don’t you get it, the good names are restricted, the B+ grade is selling at a premium, plus premium renewal, the B++ grade is less of a premium, and then you have everything else.
If it takes end users 5 years to catch on, most of you guys will be bust by paying all your premium renewals, there is little literature on price increases. If DONUTS wants you to give up your premium domains, they will jack the renewal on you, and then take it back, and reauction it, who the hell knows anything with this stuff.
Regualr .com’s have a standard practice, standard renewal, they are all treated as equals. GURU was hype, everyone jumped on, and wanted one, now nobody knows what the hell to do with all these self proclaimed guru’s running around.
I think unregistry is the only company to have straight forward pricing, as more of these will flood into the marketplace you will see less, and less activity, we are 2 weeks in, and 90% of the gtld’s have less than 5k reg’s. You would think the majority would be taken in reservation, and first day GA.
The real business is selling the DPML blocks, and such services, the registries have set themselves to make money, because that is what makes the world go around.
You will be convincing end users why they should pay you $1000 for a domain, then pay $250 in renewal fees a year on them, compared to their .com’s, so you can just break even. Think people, you are being played.
DrDomainer says
Sorry can’t answer that back at the moment ,) it’s valentines day and my special lady needs my full attention.
Frank Schilling says
“”Why, Frank… as you’ve frequently said yourself, .COM isn’t going away…Why would they do so?”””
Because sometimes the com version of certain names is longer, or ungainly, or doesn’t work as well Joseph. The time of slapping a com on the end of anything and it having value is drawing to a close. Can you mooch a few years of traffic like you could with wwwkeyword.com names as people mistype the new ones? Yes. Is that a long term recipe for winning? no.
I’m not dropping my coms yet but some tens of thousands of weaker ones will probably get tossed in the next few years. I deleted 80,000 manually on one day about 18 months ago.
You gotta cull the flock.
Domaining is about keeping names that are good enough to bring you regular opportunities to make money through traffic or sale. “Some” of these new extensions are going to bring you more opportunities, faster than the pigeon shit that’s left in com. Some won’t.
Uniregistry ‘is’ going to have low cost fixed price renewals. You can read the registry operator’s question# 18 of their application (published online) to glean info about their plans in regard to pricing and renewal. I believe namespaces are like Countries. Those with low taxes (low cost fixed price renewals) hands off governance (no variable pricing and registration freedoms) and strong rule of law (anti-abuse provisions) are those that thrive to the envy of others.
I look forward to Uniregistry’s namespaces becoming the land of liberty, freedom and opportunity for you all.
Joseph Peterson says
@Frank,
It’s true that some .COM domains are quite long and ungainly. But whenever that is true, then it’s also true that the matching nTLD version is long and ungainly as well. The difference in length between, say, Metadata.guru and MetadataGuru.com — or between any nTLD and the full-string .COM — is always exactly 3 letters. So where the name is long and ungainly, the fault is in the name itself and not in the .COM extension.
Without the .COM forwarded to the nTLD or vice versa, the name itself (as it is spoken) becomes long and ungainly — to the tune of an extra word. If there is a MetadataGuru.com out there, then the owner of Metadata.guru — and his customers / site visitors — will instinctively pronounce the name as “Metadata dot guru” rather than simply “Metadata Guru”. They’ll do so in order to differentiate between 2 domains that correspond to 1 name.
And that’s ungainly.
The analogy with wwwdomain.com / http://www.domain.com confusion isn’t really valid. Such issues were never about name ambiguity; they were about typos. What we’re facing here is an environment in which nTLD-based brand names and the matching .COM brand names each own only half of their identity.
This won’t be true of truly generic extensions such as .WEB, for instance. But when the extension is meant to be read as part of the name, then that same name can exist entirely to the left of a .COM. People are quite accustomed to that; and, since .COM won’t vanish, they’ll remain constantly exposed to that ubiquitous naming principle.
When you go out of your house, you lock your front door AND your back door. It does little good to lock just one.
I hope to see lots of websites built on these new extensions. But they should do it the right way — with a .COM domain to back them up, when appropriate.
P.S. Uniregistry is doing some very good things with its policies. Bravo!
Frank Schilling says
Ok. you make a good point.. Wise to get the .com for now I suppose. A better analogy might have been folks in the early years adding www. to the front of an address where today’s generation (just 10 years down the road) is very unlikely to do that. As you correctly point out, today if you say: ” visit my site metadataguru” people are going to add the .com and assume it.. once you get to critical mass though and 1000+ strings are out later this year and google and amazon are marketing theirs, then that propensity to “assume” .com as people do today, goes away.. I believe it will be a shorter curve on the way down until people say “go to metadata guru” and our generation stops assuming .com as they do today. But if you’re spending 1000 bucks now, quite right.. get the matching com if it gives you traffic insurance or makes you feel better. Thanks for the compliment on Uniregistry. I am trying to build a registry that let’s its registrants prosper. We’ll get there : )
JZ says
this was possible when there were only 3 main gtlds to remember and your own country code. with 1000 gtlds on the way and more in the future remember where the dot goes will become increasingly difficult. telling people to go to whatever.whatever is no big deal however i do find it a bit annoying that the word “dot” will now be in the middle of most business names when it doesn’t belong in the actual name of the business. with .com it was at least after the business name, not in it.
jZ says
it used to be you only had to know three gtlds and your country code. easy enough. if these new gtlds catch on and become commonplace, it will be impossible for people to remember even a fraction of them. you could tell someone go to metadataguru but you’ll have to assume they know where to put the dot. does it always go before the last word? maybe..for now.
having to say go to metadata dot guru is no big deal though i do find the fact that the word “dot” is going to be in the middle of many business names when it does not belong there a bit cumbersome. the man who invented the period would happy..or angry when everyone calls it a dot instead of a period..lol.
Richard Tindal says
“If DONUTS wants you to give up your premium domains, they will jack the renewal on you, and then take it back, and reauction it, who the hell knows anything with this stuff. ”
That won’t happen. It’s not how we treat registrants, and it’s prohibited by our Registry agreement with ICANN, and our agreement with Registrars. These safeguards aren’t just in Donuts’ TLDs. The same limits on renewal price increase are in all new TLD registry contracts with ICANN.
Richard Tindal, Donuts
Rich says
Richard Tindal@
How much is the increase fee every year ? and every how many years is the contract with ICANN being renew ?
Andrew Allemann says
Price controls for new TLDs aren’t what they are for existing ones, but there is a notice period required. If a registry were to jack up prices, you’d be able to renew the domain for up to 10 years at the current price before the price increase goes into effect.
Here’s the relevant language from the contract:
(b) With respect to renewal of domain name registrations, Registry Operator shall provide ICANN and each ICANN accredited registrar that has executed the registry-registrar agreement for the TLD advance written notice of any price increase (including as a result of the elimination of any refunds, rebates, discounts, product tying, Qualified Marketing Programs or other programs which had the effect of reducing the price charged to registrars) of no less than one hundred eighty (180) calendar days. Notwithstanding the foregoing sentence, with respect to renewal of domain name registrations: (i) Registry Operator need only provide thirty (30) calendar days notice of any price increase if the resulting price is less than or equal to (A) for the period beginning on the Effective Date and ending twelve (12) months following the Effective Date, the initial price charged for registrations in the TLD, or (B) for subsequent periods, a price for which Registry Operator provided a notice pursuant to the first sentence of this Section 2.10(b) within the twelve (12) month period preceding the effective date of the proposed price increase; and (ii) Registry Operator need not provide notice of any price increase for the imposition of the Variable Registry-Level Fee set forth in Section 6.3. Registry Operator shall offer registrars the option to obtain domain name registration renewals at the current price (i.e., the price in place prior to any noticed increase) for periods of one (1) to ten (10) years at the discretion of the registrar, but no greater than ten (10) years.
Domainer Extraordinaire says
Frank if you were given some magic pixie dust and given the chance to get out of .whatevers and get back all you have invested, would you do it?
Your answer will help us determine if you are delusional.
Frank Schilling says
I’m an entrepreneur – I make things happen and I take risks. Do me a favor and ask that same question again in 12 months. I’ll give you an honest answer then. I have been at this for years and I have not sold a single name yet in GA so its not a fair time to answer.
Domainer Extraordinaire says
Fair enough.
Rich says
Thank you Andrew
Mr.T says
http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/advisor/domainers-concerned-gtlds-153651921.html
This article pretty much sums it all up and I couldn’t agree more. I’ve said for a long time that gTLD’s are a welcome change in terms of brandability. Future branding will be without the .com and involve gTLD extensions.
1) It’s easier
2) It looks better
3) It’s more descriptive
Sure, until the average Joe understands the new gTLD’s a brand may want to hold on to the .com and forward it to the new gTLD (if they own it), but as soon as people “get” what new tld’s are all about, the “.com” extension will go downhill because it’s nothing else but “excess waste”.
Change happens for a reason, new gTLD’s are no exception.
DrDomainer says
Franks going to see the true facts
from viewing stats and sales from his platforms.
5 years time will start to show the
facts .com will become the global higher class extension with daily
7 figure sales to prove it.
I have been changing my system lately! .com always be KING but I can see some opportunities to make some profit with gTLDs like
Page Howe done with 3dprinting.guru
I agree Franks doing the correct thing deleting lots of his .com portfolio and I’m doing to same with
my .coms they have to be 100%
perfection.
gTLDs are going to be like the sea
and before the internet domain space was just land with some ponds. Its WIPEOUT time and true
premium .coms will be a LIGHT HOUSE with a Oil Well revenue engine build into them.
I bought TattooRemoval.guru
do I want TattooRemovalGuru.com
no because its too long and if I
started doing this with all the domains I buy in the future it would
be bad invest for me.
TattooRemoval.com is the type of domain that would be truly valuable.
@ Joseph
I do understand your point of view and your correct but domain investors from now on have to be so focus and in the zone to be successful.
gTLDs have change the domaining industry making it like stepping into the Olympics the winners will get BIGGER REWARDS!!
Downside is there will be a SEA FULL of domainer LOSERS.
Join.me and Joinme.com are both
very valuable but most domainers can’t afford these type of domains. So they are going to buy these type of versions
TattooRemovalGuru.com
and lose lots of money.
Rick Schwartz always talks about the first type of domains you buy are critical so its good to only buy category killer coms.
Chris Hughes (@chrishughesuk) says
People used to buy compact discs when the matching LPs were available.
Konstantinos Zournas says
Not quite the same. Don’t you think?
Chris Hughes (@chrishughesuk) says
It’s good enough.
jZ says
and now people are more likely to buy LP’s than cds and everyone who bought cds now buy digital.
Joseph Peterson says
Between LPs and CDs there is no question of ambiguity whatsoever. Between any 2 very similar web addresses, there will always inevitably be some degree of ambiguity. Unless one extension — let’s say .COM — falls into complete disuse, there will still be 2 names / addresses susceptible to mutual confusion.
And this isn’t strictly a question of full-string .COM versus the divided-string nTLDs. The same applies to such pairs as the following:
.CO.UK / .UK
.COM.MX / .MX
.WEB / .WEBS
Ambiguity doesn’t go away unless one half of any pair becomes almost or entirely obsolete.
Kate says
This is just proof that there is a lot of uneducated speculation, newbies don’t do research and do irrational things buying up random domains that nobody wants.
PS: somebody registered MetadataGuru.com yesterday. But I wouldn’t expect a lot of leak traffic on this one.
I hold Frank in high esteem but I am not as enthusiastic as he is about new extensions. I have a lot more faith in the ccTLDs.
I think history just repeats itself, but on a much wider scale.
But it doesn’t matter since the casino always wins and Frank still owns a lot of nice .com.
sandor says
Why on earth shouldn’t many people see abc.xyz as a decent or better alternative to abcxyz.com. If legal hurdles have been largely passed, it’s up to google and amazon to decide whether applicants make a small multiple on their investment, or a large one.